Welcome back to Let’s Talk, a series of conversations exploring the struggle and beauty of being alive. Our country needs more healing spaces and experiences, especially now, and my hope is that Let’s Talk may meet that need in some small way.
This week, I’m thrilled to introduce my dear friend and colleague in the yoga world, Christy. Join us for a conversation about living with discomfort rather than pushing it away, raising consciousness to better serve ourselves and others, and her experience relating racism against the Asian community to the Black Lives Matter movement.
Christy Kokami is a yoga specialist in alignment, backcare, and scoliosis. Based out of NYC, she joins us from her former home in Hawaii, where she is taking advantage of this time to play and share in the online world of yoga and healthy bites (check out her YouTube channel), meditate with Buddhist monks, and most importantly, hang out with her grandmother, who is her favorite human. Connect with her on Instagram at @christykokami.
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Lauren: Christy! We're living through such a chaotic time. I want to start by asking you how you're feeling right now, today.
Christy: I think there's been an ongoing feeling, since a little bit before the pandemic started, of underlying anxiety. We're living in a very uncomfortable and anxiety-provoking time, with the coronavirus and the things that are happening within our own country, in terms of having to reform and shift. It's okay, though. Having the anxiety is good, because it helps you get clarity on what you want to enact and how can you work with that. It's not about pressing it. It's not about pushing it away. It's about really understanding where it comes from and moving in a direction that will serve yourself, and in turn, serve everybody.
Lauren: I like what you said about learning how to work with that reality. It's kind of like being in relationship with it rather than, as you said, running in the other direction.
Christy: Oh, yeah. That's when things get really weird, and not in a good way.
Lauren: Tell us how this pandemic has affected your life and livelihood.
Christy: As you know, I'm a yoga instructor. I have shifted everything online. I started doing things on YouTube, Patreon, and teaching classes on the internet. It's been an interesting shift, because I noticed a lot of my work — you know, since we do yoga for backcare and scoliosis — is translatable and useful to a large audience. Because it's now available online, I can reach people in my network who I normally wouldn't be able to serve. I was initially seeing people from my New York network, and it slowly started shifting to people from my Hawaii, Colorado, and California networks. People around the globe have back pain. It's very common, especially with the way that we live now. It's been nice, and it's put me back in contact with a lot of people I am not usually able to see.
Lauren: Yeah. I think that's a refreshing way to look at it. By living through this experience, have you run into any particular challenges or struggles along the way?
Christy: Definitely. With the pandemic, and what's been said about the Asian community as a result — it's been very interesting seeing how that has affected the way I interact with people. It's made me more aware. I grew up in Hawaii, where as an Asian person, I was part of the majority. I was very fortunate to experience that. But seeing Asian people in the mainland who have been attacked as a result of the coronavirus — that's been very eye opening for me. I've been very lucky to have a network that's been very vocal about it. We've seen terrible things, like people being attacked out of nowhere. Even old people. And you just don't punch old people, you know? So that's been very awakening.
It has also been eye-opening to see what comes up in my own view of that, too. To really examine and lean into it and ask myself: What would make somebody so angry that they would attack someone? To really try to understand how this happens, how we can prevent it from happening, and avoid that misunderstanding and level of hatred — or whatever it is. That's been a very interesting practice.
Lauren: Yeah. When you try to understand where they're coming from, how does it help you, or where does it guide you?
Christy: I think it helps soften me. So I don't become so upset about how we let this happen. It also helps me empathize with other groups and see what my role relating to them has been. During a meditation, I was thinking about how we're seeing a resurgence of racism within the Asian community. It's something that has happened many times before, and it's interesting to ask why, culturally, this has sort of been okay. There's the whole idea of the model minority... culturally, what have we done that has kind of helped this happen, right? Being an Asian person is a lot about not showing your suffering, not burdening others with your pain, and just pushing through.
And that might've worked for our ancestors. It might've gotten us through, but I've had to look at what really serves us now, because we live in a different time. So it's been really cool to see people kind of wake up, and see myself kind of wake up, in terms of where I come from, culturally. What about that is serving me? What about it is not? What do I want to perpetuate? How can I support other groups, too? Because at the end of the day, we're all the same.
Lauren: Yes. What you're saying is so powerful, and beautiful — the way you're allowing your personal experience with racism to trickle out to compassion and support for other groups. In a lot of ways, that feels like the theme of this year, because the pandemic — take racial justice out of the equation, just for a moment -- shows our interconnectedness and how one person's health or lack of health affects people in their vicinity. I love how that's being mirrored in your thoughts on racial justice. Your experience influences the way you think and react to another group's experience. It's powerful. It seems like this year is setting us up for a lot of big realizations like that.
Christy: Coming together is the big theme. With the pandemic, everyone has a choice about how they want to interact. You can really zoom in to your own wants and needs — like, I want to go back to work so I can feed my family — and that's totally legit. But when it starts like infringing on other people's rights and health... When you're unable to zoom out enough to see that it might not be safe for other people, it might spread disease. It's interesting to see how people react and how much they can widen their scope for other people. It's tough, because there's not always a right answer.
Lauren: It's living with as much graciousness as you can for yourself and others. My thought about zooming in on your own livelihood was that there is something innately human in that. We've had to worry about our own survival forever, and that's natural, but maybe this is also part of our evolution. Maybe we're being invited towards it this year -- how can I think, not only about my own survival, my own livelihood, but also about the survival of those around me, the other people in my community and world?
Christy: Yeah. In Buddhism, there are so many different types of hells. They're all layered. I don't think of them as literal hells that you go to, with monsters, although that's how they're described. You can be reborn into any of these. One is animal hell. In this animal hell, you're basically just an animal; you're very reactive to everything around you. So, I don't look at it as actually turning into an animal. I think it represents different levels of consciousness. How awake you are to what's going around you. Even in the highest level of hell, where things are "better," everything is super amazing, but things are so good that you you're completely ignorant of all the suffering that happens below, and that in itself is suffering.
Lauren: Wow. Yeah. It's so interesting how we see those mirrored in humanity — in living, breathing humans — and maybe perhaps especially mirrored during this pandemic. Yeah... [laughter]
What unexpected sources of comfort or joy have you been able to find during all of this?
Christy: I've been finding joy in a lot of very simple comforts. I've been going back to things I had been wanting to do more of, so I do a lot of meditation. I do a lot of yoga. I found that I had been putting those things off a lot before the pandemic, and shortening my time with them so I could work. It's nice that I've been able to give back to myself so I can really hone in on being able to share from a place of authenticity. That's what my work is for, to be able to self-examine and heal. That has been a big source of comfort. It's also taught me how to know when I need to back off — a lot of us who are attracted to New York are fiery personalities and go getters — so it's been great to dig into that soft side, that sweet side. It's okay to rest, really rest, where you're not allowing your mind to race everywhere. You're very present.
Lauren: Yes. Because even if we're aware of the so-called grind and try to manage its effects, when you're participating in the world, doing your thing, and living your purpose, it's hard not to get caught up in the race. You feel its effects on your spirit, health, mental wellness, everything. I think you're right; the power of rest has been highlighted in a nice way this year. I hope that that stays with us after this is over.
Christy: I think it's one of the great gifts of this particular situation. Understanding that you can be of better service to others if you are of better service to yourself. Philosophically all of these practices, like yoga and Buddhism, talk about cultivating that sort of compassion and softness within yourself. It's ultimately going to affect how you interact with the world and how you see it.
Lauren: We've already touched a bit on the outcry for racial justice we're seeing in the US right now. We haven't seen anything like this in our lifetimes, and it's been both invigorating and alarming, as we look at the things we haven't dealt with for so long. I'm curious about the fact that we're finally paying attention in the middle of a pandemic. I'm not sure that's a coincidence. Do you think the pandemic played a role in this outcry?
Christy: Definitely. Alexandria Ocasio Cortez has been talking about how all of the issues with healthcare and racial inequality did not just appear. These things were happening for long periods of time. They are part of a system that is broken. And because the pandemic put a lot of people into unemployment or working from home, we had the opportunity to face our thoughts all day and confront them. Things are quieter because you're not distracted by hobbies or hanging out with friends. You have to face all of your demons and everything about the system. We've had more time to be thoughtful and dig into these issues, and we're constantly sharing information on social media, which I think has helped a lot of people wake up and see what's happening. That has helped the Black Lives Matter movement.
Lauren: I think so too. Because people were stuck at home and overwhelmed by the pandemic, they couldn't distract themselves, this time, from the violence against Black Americans — by the grind, by busyness, by productivity, all those things. They could no longer turn their heads from this issue.
Okay. What do you miss most? If you could go out right now and not even worry about a mask or getting close to people, what's the one thing you would do?
Christy: Omg. There are so many things. I would just give all of my friends and loved ones a big hug.
Lauren: OMG. That is the best and most simple answer, but it really says it all.
Christy: Physical contact is ingrained in us. It's just one of the ways we express love.
Lauren: Yeah. I've wondered how the generations that are alive right now will suffer after this, if we'll carry this experience of not being able to touch for a long period with us in some way. It would be interesting to figure out — does hugging actually reduce after this? Does closeness or physical intimacy decline in some way?
Christy: It probably does have a huge impact on our psyche. In Hawaii, the way that we greet each other, even if we don't know the other person, is by giving a hug. And we give one of those fake air kisses. We're very physical people, even if we don't know you. It's always been funny, whenever I've moved back to the mainland, where you give people handshakes.
Lauren: That makes sense. I hadn't put this together, and I've never been to Hawaii, but — for those who don't know, Christy and I did yoga training together in New York and have taken a lot of classes together. She is never afraid to touch someone who has an injury or needs a massage to work out a tight muscle.
Do you think you'll be a different person on the other side of this year? Do you expect it to change you?
Christy: Oh, yeah. I think it has already changed everybody. Like, you're never going to stay the same person. I'm not the same person that I am at the beginning of this interview. Everything is constantly changing. After this pandemic, I'd like to think I'd be a little softer, a little more thoughtful, and awake to a bigger perspective and global community — one in which I might have a better idea of what role I play in it.
Lauren: That's amazing. You're right. There's no normal, we're always changing, and change is the only constant. We might as well lean into that.
Christy: Definitely. I mean, or you could run from it. That's also an option.
Lauren: Good luck with that!
[laughter]
Be sure to listen to the recording for bonus conversation about togetherness and belonging at the end! And continue getting to know Christy — she’s wonderful — on Instagram and YouTube.
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Awakening Gently with Yoga and Meditation Expert Christy Kokami